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Thanks, Will. Good analysis. I learned this lesson a few years ago with Seagate SMR drives and a 3ware se. Impossible to replace a disk in a RAID5 array, the controller would eventually fail the rebuild. I think you should explain how SMR works with a bunch of images or an animation. Most people do not understand how complex SMR is when data needs to be moved from a bottom shingled track. And really nobody you, too mentions how inefficient this is in case of power consumption as all the reading and writing while moving the data on a top shingle consumes energy while an CMR drive is sleeping all the time.
I wonder to what extent can performance be regained with its use. Also, if you trim the entire disk and maybe wait a little , does it return to initial performance? Has anyone tested this? In my opinion, the SMR Reds are a case of fraudulent advertising. I just want a clear demarcation. Even down to external drives needing to be marked in this way. If people can sue Apple for advertising a phone has 16GB of storage when some of that is taken up by the operating system, those two missing words may make a huge different in the legal circus.
Yes, there is an array running here, due to the brilliance of picking drives from different production runs and vendors, that has half SMR and half CMR. Great article as always. Such a shame, I was happy with putting red drives into client Nas now I will be putting ironwolf, what were Western digital thinking? Was there nobody on the team who realised the consequences? I have a problem with your RAIDZ test: normally I replace failed disks with brand new, just unpacked ones, not the ones that were used to write a lot of data and immediately disconnected.
But you are not showing how long does it take for an array to rebuild under those conditions? This is a a great article. Their insight into the drive being used while doing the rebuild is great too. More trolls on STH when you get to these mass audience articles. But great test methodology STH. Thank you for the article and thank you in particular Will for the link to the WD Product brief.
I was under the misapprehension along with that sinking feeling from reporting from other sites that all 3TB WD Reds are SMR when in fact there are two models. Replacing with 1 SMR disk. To be crystal clear, I knew what SMR was, and that the drive used it. Initially it worked reasonably fast, but as time went on, it slowed down. I use ZFS on it, with snapshots, so it actually stores multiple backups.
For my use, it was the only 8TB drive on the market for a reasonable price at that time , it works well. I do get the unhappyness about not branding correctly but I cannot beleive that the results are this severe for consumer NAS especially? Robert, that video is very hard to follow. They are using smaller capacity drives with different NAS systems. They are also not doing a realistic test since it seems they are not putting a workload on the NAS during rebuilds?
It is strange not to at least generate some workload during a rebuild. People are seeing very poor performance with these SMR drives and Synology as well, even in normal operation. The systems and capacities used will impact results in different ways. We wanted to present a real-world use case with ZFS so our readers have some sense of the impact. We use ZFS heavily and many of our readers do as well.
My use case would just be me and my wife, and once the newborn is at age, perhaps him? But for a consumer case is the whole SMR debate a real problem? Taking into account that you regularly make backups from the backups. I truly would like to know in order to make a decision.
Robert — I generally look for low-cost CMR drives, and expect that they will fail on me. While I expect the drive failures, I also look for a predictable level of performance during operation and rebuilds. I generally tell people RAID arrays tend to operate at the speed of their slowest part. If you mix drives, the slower ones tend to dictate performance more times than not. Why is that? It seems like a marketing TEST!!! How BIG is it? Is that the next step? WTF is that???
Well, i got new for you: crystaldiskinfo CAN!!! How about that? Stupid WD support…. Paste it to a text editor, and voila!!! They wrote the article like someone who uses ZFS though. Ars articles always lack the depth of real reporting, but do provide an entertainment factor and many times the commenters have much more insight which is what I love finding and reading.
The drives perform terrible ever since day 1, causing the whole PC to appear unresponsive for minutes the moment 1 file in the Steam library is rewritten for game updates. Things get worse when Steam needs to preallocate storage space for new games, often I have to leave the machine alone for two to three hours. I already changed motherboard once because I thought it was a motherboard issue. Even with a new motherboard the problem persisted.
Then I found out about this lawsuit. And upon further investigation I found out that these disks are SMR. I filed a support request with Seagate. I received a phone call from the rep this morning. They were apologetic, but then they dropped the bombshell: All Seagate 2. Great article, thanks for the info. Had no idea this was a thing but glad I googled it now. STH: do you have a more complete followup article? There are tons of loose ends in this old stuff. Or has someone else done better followup?
SMR drives actually created a new tier for my server… basically a read only tier that i need to read from but rarely write…they are indeed cheap though. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Sign me up for the STH newsletter! This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.
Overview Reviews 4 Discussion. Hard drives that write data in overlapping, "shingled" tracks, have greater areal density than ones that do not. The tracks are perpendicular, they are also shingled - layered - on top of each other. SMR allows vendors to offer higher capacity without the need to fundamentally change the underlying recording technology. The first drives are expected in , in either flavor. SMR is well suited for high-capacity, low-cost use where writes are few and reads are many.
SMR has worse sustained write performance than CMR, which can cause severe issues during resilver or other write-intensive operations, up to and including failure of that resilver. It is often desirable to choose a CMR drive instead. This thread attempts to pull together known SMR drives, and the sources for that information. As a rule of thumb, avoid DM-SMR drives, unless you have a specific use case where the increased resilver time a week or longer is acceptable, and you know the drive will function for ZFS during resilver.
See page 24 of d as well as i and j. Reactions: JPillow , Arwen , Spearfoot and 16 others. Join the discussion. Latest reviews tsf-freenas 5. Upvote 0 Downvote. Snow 5. Arwen 5. This is great list and resource for understanding vendor's use of SMR drives when then they did not clearly identify them as such.
In fact, this resource seems to have caught the Internet's attention. Read more….